Are the HD63C09EP compatible with HD6809P?

[Caius]

Hi,
I have a non-working arcade board that use a HD63C09EP CPU.
I discover that the CPU is bad,so I have to substitute it.But I'm unable to
find this kind of CPU.
SO,can I use instead a more available HD6809 CPU?
Are these two CPUs full compatible?
Thanks in advance

[Peter Velan]

Post by Caius
I have a non-working arcade board that use a HD63C09EP CPU.
I discover that the CPU is bad,so I have to substitute it.But I'm unable to
find this kind of CPU.
SO,can I use instead a more available HD6809 CPU?
Are these two CPUs full compatible?

No, Hitachi's

HD63C09EP CMOS, external clock source, max 3MHz
HD6809 NMOS, internal clock-source, max 1MHz

Because the E-types are driven by an external clock, you could not
replace an E-CPU with a non-E type.

IIRC there are some additional opcodes in the 6309 family of CPUs.

Greetings,
Peter

[james]

On Fri, 01 Dec 2006 11:50:06 +0100, Peter Velan

+++> I have a non-working arcade board that use a HD63C09EP CPU.
+++> I discover that the CPU is bad,so I have to substitute it.But I'm unable to
+++> find this kind of CPU.
+++> SO,can I use instead a more available HD6809 CPU?
+++> Are these two CPUs full compatible?
+++
+++No, Hitachi's
+++
+++HD63C09EP CMOS, external clock source, max 3MHz
+++HD6809 NMOS, internal clock-source, max 1MHz
+++

************

MC/HD68B09 are NMOS with internal clock generator. Max crystal
frequency is 8MHz. Although later date codes of the MC68B09 can run
well with a 12MHz crystal.

+++Because the E-types are driven by an external clock, you could not
+++replace an E-CPU with a non-E type.
+++
+++IIRC there are some additional opcodes in the 6309 family of CPUs.
+++

************

Correct there are two extra accumaltors and all four accumaltors can
be concactedinto one 32 bit register. There is also a mode register
that can be used to enable an one byte primative pipelining for
instruction fetch.

james

[Peter Velan]

Post by james
MC/HD68B09 are NMOS with internal clock generator. Max crystal
frequency is 8MHz. Although later date codes of the MC68B09 can run
well with a 12MHz crystal.

The real CPU clock frequency (opcode and bus cycles) of a 6809 CPU is
allways 1/4 of crystal frequency.

Post by james
Correct there are two extra accumaltors and all four accumaltors can
be concactedinto one 32 bit register. There is also a mode register
that can be used to enable an one byte primative pipelining for
instruction fetch.

Hmm, sounds interesting. But I could not identify these two extra
accumulators in Hitachi's databook. Do you have some more informations
about these extras?

Peter

[Bjarne Bäckström]

Post by Peter Velan

Post by james
MC/HD68B09 are NMOS with internal clock generator. Max crystal
frequency is 8MHz. Although later date codes of the MC68B09 can run
well with a 12MHz crystal.

The real CPU clock frequency (opcode and bus cycles) of a 6809 CPU is
allways 1/4 of crystal frequency.

Post by james
Correct there are two extra accumaltors and all four accumaltors can
be concactedinto one 32 bit register. There is also a mode register
that can be used to enable an one byte primative pipelining for
instruction fetch.

Hmm, sounds interesting. But I could not identify these two extra
accumulators in Hitachi's databook. Do you have some more informations
about these extras?

You can find a fairly thorough description here:

<http://groups.google.com/group/comp.sys.m6809/browse_thread/thread/c710
a832efe0c80e/8d150d97d185e5fb?q=Hirotsugu+Kakugawa>

[Peter Velan]

Post by Peter Velan

Post by james
MC/HD68B09 are NMOS with internal clock generator. Max crystal
frequency is 8MHz. Although later date codes of the MC68B09 can run
well with a 12MHz crystal.

The real CPU clock frequency (opcode and bus cycles) of a 6809 CPU is
allways 1/4 of crystal frequency.

Post by james
Correct there are two extra accumaltors and all four accumaltors can
be concactedinto one 32 bit register. There is also a mode register
that can be used to enable an one byte primative pipelining for
instruction fetch.

Hmm, sounds interesting. But I could not identify these two extra
accumulators in Hitachi's databook. Do you have some more informations
about these extras?

<http://groups.google.com/group/comp.sys.m6809/browse_thread/thread/c710a832efe0c80e/8d150d97d185e5fb?q=Hirotsugu+Kakugawa>

Uuh, very interesting - Bjarne, thank you ver much for this link!

Peter

[james]

On Sat, 02 Dec 2006 12:26:49 +0100, Peter Velan

+++> MC/HD68B09 are NMOS with internal clock generator. Max crystal
+++> frequency is 8MHz. Although later date codes of the MC68B09 can run
+++> well with a 12MHz crystal.
+++
+++The real CPU clock frequency (opcode and bus cycles) of a 6809 CPU is
+++allways 1/4 of crystal frequency.
+++

************

Correct

+++> Correct there are two extra accumaltors and all four accumaltors can
+++> be concactedinto one 32 bit register. There is also a mode register
+++> that can be used to enable an one byte primative pipelining for
+++> instruction fetch.
+++
+++Hmm, sounds interesting. But I could not identify these two extra
+++accumulators in Hitachi's databook. Do you have some more informations
+++about these extras?
+++
+++Peter

***********

They were never officially published

james

[Mark McDougall]

Post by Caius
I have a non-working arcade board that use a HD63C09EP CPU.
I discover that the CPU is bad,so I have to substitute it.But I'm unable to
find this kind of CPU.

Check the coco newsgroup (coco3.com) or comp.sys.tandy as I believe
there are people who stock this chip for coco upgrades.

<www.cloud9tech.com> was stocking them, but are temporarily not taking
new orders...

Regards,

[Peter Velan]

Naah, the message below was not written by me :-)

Post by Caius
I have a non-working arcade board that use a HD63C09EP CPU.
I discover that the CPU is bad,so I have to substitute it.But I'm unable to
find this kind of CPU.

Cheers,
Peter

[Mark McDougall]

Post by Peter Velan
Naah, the message below was not written by me :-)

Whoops, careless posting... ;) Sorry.

Regards,

[james]

+++Hi,
+++I have a non-working arcade board that use a HD63C09EP CPU.
+++I discover that the CPU is bad,so I have to substitute it.But I'm unable to
+++find this kind of CPU.
+++SO,can I use instead a more available HD6809 CPU?
+++Are these two CPUs full compatible?
+++Thanks in advance
+++

****************

Look for a MC68B09E or HD68B09E and hope that the software does not
use any of the HD63C09E instructions that are not available in the
MC68B09E.

You need the external clock version of the 6809. Also the 6309 has an
expanded instruction set. later date code of the 68B09E, past about
1989, will run at 3MHz clock speed if some form of heat sinking is
used.

james

james

[tim lindner]

Post by Caius
Hi,
I have a non-working arcade board that use a HD63C09EP CPU.
I discover that the CPU is bad,so I have to substitute it.But I'm unable to
find this kind of CPU.
SO,can I use instead a more available HD6809 CPU?
Are these two CPUs full compatible?
Thanks in advance

The other posts tell about the electrical and clock requirements of
replacing a 6309 with a 6809.

As far as software compatiabity, you should not have any problems. I
don't know of any Arcade machines that actually _used_ the extra
functionality of the 6309.